June 26, 2024
What To Do When Christian Influencers Fail You
Season 2
Deep Dives Into Problematic Religious Beliefs
How To Deal With Others As A Christian
Music And Other Creative Forms
Welcome to Season Two. I am starting a series on the power of music and its influence on our lives. Episode one introduces the specifics of what I plan to discuss throughout the series.
Buckle up; this season is going to blow your mind.
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00:00 - Welcome to Season Two
03:35 - When Christian Influences Fail Us
09:19 - Christian Artists Leaving the Faith
14:28 - The Music I Thought Was Safe
23:25 - The Irony of Skillet
27:58 - Finding True Worship Again
WEBVTT
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Welcome back.
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I'm your host, anna Murby.
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This is season two, episode one.
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If you haven't watched my latest episode, it was just kind of updating you on how season two is going to be so that you get an idea of what's going on.
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You can listen to that.
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Otherwise, I'm just going to give a brief overview of what I plan on doing.
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I'm going to be talking about certain topics in the form of like a series, so each week is going to be related kind of to what I talked about from now on, and these are meant to plant seeds.
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Basically, it's not going to be easy topics for many Christians.
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It's probably going to rock your world.
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I know the first topic I'm going to talk about really did mine.
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But it's not just for Christians, it's for those who are seeking truth, who just want truth.
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They don't want to be lied to anymore.
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They don't want half truth, they want the full truth.
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That's what this podcast is meant to do is to plant seeds of truth, and God will water them and make them grow in his timing.
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So, without further ado, I'm going to start giving you an I guess like an introduction to what I'm planning on talking about.
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But the question, the topic for today's episode is what to do when your Christian influences fail you.
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And as a non-believer who might be listening to this, you're probably thinking well, that's not going to pertain to me, but it kind of does, in the sense that I'm pretty sure at one point you blamed your reason for not wanting to follow Christ on Christians.
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They're two-faced, they're backstabbers.
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They, you know, they're hypoc're, hypocrites.
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You know I can't follow a God whose people don't act like him, like all these different things I'm pretty sure you've said, we've all said them at one point or another.
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So this is not just for Christians, this is also for those who want to blame Christians as to the reason why they don't want to follow God Because we're human.
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God's not.
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He can't fail.
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We fail all the time.
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We're human, we make mistakes.
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Christians don't become like God in that sense that we are perfect just because we ask him into our hearts.
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We still make mistakes.
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So I wanted to get that out there first and foremost.
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This is for anybody who wants to hear truth.
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You don't have to be a Christian, you don't have to be someone who's thinking about being a Christian.
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You can be wherever you are right now.
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But if you want to know absolute truth, then this will be for you, because that's what I'm going to try to do my best, in a gracious way, is to share the truth of what I've been learning through my studies on these topics that I'm going to be discussing throughout the next seasons.
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So what do we do when our Christian influencers fail us?
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I don't know how many of you have been paying attention to any of this kind of Christian world Like.
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There's some Christian worship artists, there's some Christian music artists, there's pastors who have been falling by the wayside, having problems, things.
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They've been going through saying they're no longer Christian.
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You know, just turning their back on God, saying they're no longer Christian, you know, just turning their back on God.
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And I want to focus specifically right now on this season is going to be only on Christian music worship, praise and worship.
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Christian music is what it's really going to focus on for this season, and the reason why is because that's kind of where my journey of my eyes being opened happened was with music.
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I've always loved music and I grew up in a Christian home and Christian music was safe.
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There's a radio station that says safe for the whole family.
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That's what I thought with the Christian music I listened to that, it was safe, it was good, there was nothing I had to worry about, I could put it on guilt-free, I could let anyone hear it, and they were going to hear the gospel.
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They were going to hear good things that come from God.
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That's what my whole mentality was up until 2020 lockdown, and if you listen to podcasts or you hear anybody else, I'm pretty sure you've also heard people saying 2020 was their year where God opened their eyes to things.
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Whatever it's true Like.
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I've listened to a lot of different podcasts where people are also saying the same thing, and I'm noticing a pattern that perhaps the lockdowns, as terrible as they were, there was some good that also came out of it, and my life was forever changed during that lockdown, when I had more time to settle in and focus on my relationship with God and listening to godly podcasts from people that I trusted and heard some stuff that I had never heard before.
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So I have started listening to Alan Parr.
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He has a podcast called the Beat, and I have a couple things, a couple YouTube videos that I can maybe leave links in my description for If you want to know more in depth of this topic, because he goes pretty in depth with things in a way that I can't and am not fully capable of doing, but he's done his due diligence on these things.
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And the first video that I'm going to kind of reference is called why these Popular Christian Worship Artists Left Christianity and he goes through a couple of them and talks about you know what they did, why they left, and then he will eventually give his reasons why he thinks that they left.
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And it's a pretty good episode.
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I mean I encourage you guys to listen to it.
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Like I said, I'll put in the links you can check it out.
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This podcast is meant to be more of like a friend talking with a friend.
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So I mean I'm not going to just rattle off different facts and whatnot to you guys.
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I will point you to where I'm getting my information from.
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I'm just a friend, sharing what I can retain and I remember and my heart to you because I want to see you guys thrive in finding truth.
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So he talks about a woman named Audrey Asad and I guess she's a really good worship leader.
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I don't know if she just does worship on her own or if she did it for a church.
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In one part of his video she's on stage with a church group, so I'm assuming maybe she's part of a church group, I don't know, but she really has a beautiful voice and she sings beautiful songs, worship songs about God that are really deep and theological.
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But she recently came out with a video on why she isn't following Christianity anymore, why she's no longer a Christian, and it's like about Christian deconstruction and if you don't know what that is, elisa Childers does a lot of information about that and maybe at some point I'll talk about that as well, but it's such a deep theological and apologetic topic that I don't.
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I don't know if I'll be able to get there.
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He just talks about her a little bit and you know how she fell away from God after making all these beautiful songs.
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And then he mentions Marty Sampson, who I believe was part of a Hillsong church, and just talks.
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He talks about an interview that Marty Sampson did Called, where he mentions that he is no longer a Christian and it's just mind blowing to me that these people are doing this and when I first heard this I was like what?
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I listened to?
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Hill song.
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I was like, how is this?
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Doesn't make any sense.
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And then, um, I guess there's another couple called lisa and michael gunger.
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I'm not exactly sure I know who they are, but apparently they're now embracing atheism and they're talking about it and, you know, promoting how we need to find our truth from within, find our worth from within, and all these other things that sound very new agey.
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And he just asks questions.
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He's like why is this happening?
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Why are Christian artists doing this?
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They're not the only ones, there's others that I used to listen to that I loved so much.
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Not sure how many people remember Jennifer Knapp, but I loved her music.
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I had fun singing to it because it was in an octave that I could actually do without having to strain and I just loved her music.
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But apparently she's come out as lesbian Plum.
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I don't know how many people know her, but she says LGBTQ is awesome.
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The lead singer for Cademan's Call, derek Webb, recently made a Christian with quotation marks song called I forget what it's called, but he was dressed in drag in it and he actually went to, I think, the Grammy's dressed in drag too and singing with someone called Flaney Grant.
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But it's just like all these Christian music artists are deconstructing.
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Don't get me started on talking about the pastors who are getting called out for past sins, for egregious sins, different people who share the gospel on television.
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Like all these different topics, these ones that I'm not mentioning yet, they will be talked about in seasons coming up.
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God willing, if he allows me to continue with this podcast, because these are things that have been weighing heavy on my heart and have been helping me to shape my spiritual growth in the way that I need it to be for myself, because my, as I have said in a previous episode, I need to make my faith my own, and in order to do that, I have to detangle it from everything else that I was taught how I was raised, because some of that stuff is not right.
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It's not true, not the basics of and fundamentals of Christianity.
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That's not what I'm talking about.
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I'm talking about the fluff around it that some people may say, oh, that's just a denominational difference or you don't really need to worry about that.
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Perhaps we need to worry about it a lot more than we think we do, because as I get deeper into these subjects, I realize how far I have strayed away from the actual truth of the gospel and who God really is, and I don't want my friends and family, I don't want you who I may not know, but you are listening to this right now.
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I don't want that for you either.
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The Bible says that the road to him is narrow.
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The road to God is narrow.
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That literally means that there's going to be a lot more people who think they're going to heaven, who aren't really going to heaven because we have something wrong with our theology.
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So my goal is to help in the best way that I can from an I don't want to say ignorant standpoint, because I'm not really ignorant, but more of a.
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I don't retain a lot of what's said in these videos, because these are like hour-long videos, almost an hour-long video.
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Like.
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I took some notes for this and I will.
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When I watch videos, I'll take notes and I'm actually re-watching some of these videos so that I can take notes, because I didn't before.
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Because I'm really trying to videos, so that I can take notes because I didn't before.
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Because I'm really trying to do something that I don't like to do, which is research.
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I don't like going deep in research for things.
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I don't know if that's just lazy or whatever, but I'm doing it now because I really feel that this is something God wants me to do and I want to help people be transformed.
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I want to see their lives changed and I want them to know the true Jesus.
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So that's why I'm doing this.
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That's why I'm going out of my comfort zones to research for one and also to share this, knowing that it's probably going to alienate some of my friends who might be listening to this and it might cause some division in certain things, but it's necessary because people need to know this.
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You may think that your Christian music is safe, but it might not be.
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The lead singer of Hawk Nelson I'm not sure if anyone knows about this band it's another one I used to listen to.
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Jonathan Steingard says he no longer believes in God too, and Lecrae supports the BLM stuff, the Black Lives Matter Like he supports that whole campaign he was promoting I forget what his name is.
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He was running for a seat, I believe, in Congress in Atlanta and he's he claimed.
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The guy claimed to be a pastor, but apparently he's also approving of abortion and Lecrae was supporting that.
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When I came back to Christ, he was one of the key people I listened to all the time.
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I loved his music.
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I love his passion.
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He's got a great rap.
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I mean, I don't even like rap, but I listened to him because I liked the beat, I liked what he was saying, I believed it, it was good.
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And then I find this out and I'm like what?
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It's just like somebody burst my Christian music bubble and he was one of the first ones that it happened to.
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And I'm like wow, that's crazy.
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And then I found out about Marty Sampson, audrey Assad, all these other worship leaders.
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I was like wait a minute, the worship music isn't safe either.
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There's probably things being said in there that's not right, like theologically not right.
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And then I hear about all these other musicians.
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I was like no, are you kidding me?
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Like this is going down the list of my childhood.
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My high school years.
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I wasn't allowed to listen to secular music because it wasn't safe.
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I could only listen to Christian music.
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I could only listen to Christian girl music a lot of times, but it was just Christian music in general.
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Because it was safe, it was okay.
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I couldn't listen to music which included Skillet, which I will get to in a second.
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But, kevin Max, does anyone know who DC Talk is?
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If you grew up as a Christian, you have to know who DC Talk is.
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They are a key part of the Christian scene in my opinion.
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I wasn't allowed to listen to them because they were too ruckus.
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But they were so Christian but I was.
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It was too ruckus.
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One of the guys from that says he's an ex-evangelical.
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I don't know enough that, but it's somewhere along the lines of Christian deconstruction.
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So if you're really interested in that, again, elisa Childers has her podcast and she talks a lot about this in depth.
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She can totally help you weed through all that stuff.
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But he doesn't believe in God anymore either.
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A guy from DC Talk Hello, like that was one of the biggest Christian groups, jesus freak.
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How can somebody who's sing all these godly songs, these beautiful worship songs, fall from the wayside?
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And I wrote down four of the points that Alan Parr made in his video the one that I had mentioned earlier and his podcast is called the Beat with Alan Parr made in his video the one that I had mentioned earlier and his podcast is called the Beat with Alan Parr.
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You can find it on YouTube.
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It's probably on all the podcast platforms too.
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But he says there's four reasons why this might be happening Intellectual doubts and skepticism.
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Negative experiences with church or religious community, disappointment with God, or this is a big one, especially nowadays, and it's kind of poignant that I'm finishing up the end of June with this one LGBTQ discrimination With Derek Webb.
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I think it's pretty obvious that that's his.
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You know his reason for why he's deconstructing, although he's probably been doing it for a while.
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Kevin max, I believe, supports it.
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Plum, I don't.
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I don't know enough.
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I listened to her but I had, you know, kind of backtracked a while because I just had had these feelings about certain bands.
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I mean apparently jars of clay, I to mention them, but apparently they're also.
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I don't know if they're supporting LGBTQ stuff or if they've.
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Just I think they have.
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I don't know enough about that.
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I'm going to try to go in depth with some of these specific things that I'm talking about through the series.
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So please stay tuned.
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I know I'm like throwing a whole bunch of stuff at you and you're I'm like throwing a whole bunch of darts at a bunch of balloons and some are getting popped, and you're like wait, don't stop there.
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I'm not going to stop there.
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That's why I'm choosing to make this a series rather than just one episode and then moving on to something else, because these are things that matter and these are things that we need to know because we don't want to be on the wrong theological train.
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I know I didn't want to be and, as painful as this was for me to learn these things, it's necessary because it'll get you back on track and find what's true and right.
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And through finding out all this stuff, through the tears that I shed, realizing that the music that I had grown up thinking was safe is no longer safe, man, that was a mind blow and it broke my heart and I will be honest, I could not listen to Christian music for a long time.
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Like I'm still having some trouble with it now, because I'm I've learned so much that when I listen to certain things, especially at church, with the worship music that we listen to, it's not bad.
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I'm not going there, but I would sit there and stare at the screen and I would just have anxiety because I couldn't just sing the songs, because I knew what church it was coming from, which is another topic I'll be getting into at some point, probably another season, because NAR I don't know if you know what that is, but I am going to be discussing that as well and you know music kind of ties into that as well, and you know, music kind of ties into that as well, which you'll get a little taste of maybe next week, god willing, if that's the topic that he chooses for me to talk about right away.
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But just, there's theological problems with certain worship songs.
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There's theological problems with listening to music by people who don't believe what you believe and they're just singing it and putting these people on a pedestal.
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That's basically what I was doing is I was putting them in a safe spot, I was putting them in a pedestal.
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That that almost felt like I was idolizing them, Not necessarily, but in a sense that's what I feel I was doing.
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Not necessarily, but in a sense that's what I feel I was doing.
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And that's why I was having such a hard time with this and not able to sing at church because I was scrutinizing the songs.
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I felt comatose.
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I just I could not, could not wrap my head around the fact that my whole music childhood was set aflame, basically.
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And Avalon is another one that's had some drama going on there.
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That's a band that I could listen to, even though there was a couple guys in it, but it was a safe band and my parents let me listen to it.
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But I'm now realizing in my adulthood that these people were not as safe as my family thought.
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They flew under the radar of Christian music.
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But they themselves didn't even believe what they were singing.
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It was just I don't even know.
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I don't know them personally, I haven't heard all their stories, but it's just not what they believed, I guess.
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And that's like crazy.
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How can you sing such passionate songs about God and who he is and not believe it?
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My head is swimming again just thinking about all this.
00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:05.042
Now I want to get back to what I was saying when I mentioned Skillet and said I was going to come back to that.
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I was not allowed to listen to Skillet, so much so that our school was going to do something called a human video with one of Skillet's songs and I wanted to be a part of it, but my parents didn't want me to because it was such a radically loud rock song and I couldn't do it, even though they're a Christian band.
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I was very resentful of my parents that they wouldn't let me listen to Skillet while my other friends could listen to it.
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It hurt, it made me angry because I'm like they're a Christian band.
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Why can't I listen to it?
00:21:36.795 --> 00:21:38.238
Same with DC Talk.
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I was upset that I couldn't listen to DC Talk.
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Finally, my parents let me listen to DC Talk and I literally cried when I got their first album.
00:21:46.773 --> 00:22:03.634
I was obsessed with DC Talk after that and I was obsessed with being able to listen to Skillet at some point and honestly I think the first time I ever listened to Skillet was when I was an adult, like 18, out of school, and I could buy my own music.
00:22:03.634 --> 00:22:08.644
I can't fully remember, but I believe that's when I started listening to them.
00:22:08.644 --> 00:22:24.510
But I find it very, very, very, very, very ironic that one of the groups that my parents kept me from because it was raucous music and it didn't sound Christian they.
00:22:25.272 --> 00:22:42.760
John Cooper, the lead singer of Skillet, is one of the loudest voices out there speaking against all this junk that's going on in our world today, speaking out against the theological differences in the world.
00:22:42.760 --> 00:22:44.991
He's getting so much flack from it.
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He's losing fans, he's losing friends because he's speaking the truth, he's speaking the gospel and he's unafraid and unashamed to do it, even at his concerts.
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And it's so funny that that was the band that I was kept from because they didn't sound Christian.
00:23:00.002 --> 00:23:03.580
They sounded too loud and too raw to be Christian.
00:23:03.580 --> 00:23:15.442
But the lead singer is the only one, the only one who's really speaking out super hard, other than Alyssa Childers, who used to be in Zoe Girl, if anyone knows that.
00:23:16.390 --> 00:23:23.288
But he stands firm in his faith day after day has his podcast called Cooper Stuff.
00:23:23.288 --> 00:23:26.077
I encourage you to listen to that if you haven't before.
00:23:26.077 --> 00:23:26.880
It's amazing.
00:23:26.880 --> 00:23:35.230
And he's not afraid to share the gospel and be honest with people and get down deep into the politics and everything that's going on.
00:23:35.230 --> 00:23:44.615
He calls it big Eva for big evangelical, all the different politics that are going on in the Christian church and everything Like he's calling it out.
00:23:44.615 --> 00:23:46.580
He's sharing his faith.
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He is strong in his faith.
00:23:47.990 --> 00:23:54.722
He is a Christian band that I can actually listen to now and I know what I'm going to get.
00:23:54.943 --> 00:24:07.109
It's just, it's mind-blowing that that's how it's going right now and I chuckle at that all the time, not because I'm trying to stick it to my parents or whatever and be like ha ha, you were wrong.
00:24:07.109 --> 00:24:08.832
It's nothing like that at all.
00:24:08.832 --> 00:24:10.914
It is not my parents' fault.
00:24:10.914 --> 00:24:12.538
They did not know these things.
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They did not see what was coming down the pipe.
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They did not see what was coming down the pipe.
00:24:17.984 --> 00:24:36.309
I didn't see what was coming down the pipe, and if 2020 hadn't locked us down and we didn't have all this free time to figure out things and go on YouTube and find podcasts and stuff, I think a lot of us wouldn't have been where we are now finding out the things that we know, not just spiritual nature, but in health and all this other stuff.
00:24:36.490 --> 00:25:01.540
But my point with all this is that this is a subject that is necessary to talk about, because subjects that Christians should not be approving of are being approved of in certain areas of the Christian faith, and I think it's because we have been complacent and lazy in what we believe, but it's also because we have been trusting in things we should not be trusting in.
00:25:01.540 --> 00:25:05.037
The only thing we should trust in 100% is God.
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He will never fail us, he will never lie, he is always truthful, he is always honest and he is always there for us, and no one else will ever compare to that, especially humans.
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We are all flawed, we make mistakes, we get hurt by people, we get hurt by things, and then we attribute that to God and then we say, well, god can't be true, let's go.
00:25:25.376 --> 00:25:43.957
And then we go on Instagram or whatever and we share that with other people and we ruin their faith as well, which may have been strong, but through listening to those people talking about their stuff out loud when they should just be talking about it with God, it's just too much.
00:25:43.957 --> 00:25:50.182
We should not be so focused on people and their influence on us.
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We should be more focused on God.
00:25:52.069 --> 00:26:12.153
So, as I said in the beginning, what to do when Christian influencers fail you that was a question that I asked myself two or three weeks ago at church, while I'm standing there during the worship trying really hard to worship.
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It's something that I'm just now getting back into and I want to thank personally Keith and Kristen Getty man.
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These people are wonderful.
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:25.192
Their heart for God is amazing.
00:26:25.192 --> 00:26:27.877
Their heart for worship is mind-blowing.
00:26:28.640 --> 00:26:35.880
I just recently listened to their audiobook of their new book called Sing and it's why we worship.
00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:40.616
And it's short, it's easy to read, to listen through, because I audiobook booked it.
00:26:40.616 --> 00:26:46.140
I don't know what it's like reading it, but I'm pretty sure it's also fairly easy to read.
00:26:46.140 --> 00:26:53.991
But it is so full of passion and the reason why we worship, the reason we should worship, and when I read that I realized that it's not about me.
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I have to worship and I may not like the songs that we sing at church.
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I may not fully understand the songs theologically, but if it seems theologically sound, I should be singing it and if not, I need to find a different way to praise my God because he is deserving of it.
00:27:11.837 --> 00:27:18.181
So I want to thank them for writing that book, because it's an amazing book and I also really love their music.
00:27:18.181 --> 00:27:21.178
By the way, if you don't know who they are, listen to them.
00:27:21.178 --> 00:27:28.513
It's very theologically sounded and good and, dare I say, safe.
00:27:28.534 --> 00:27:43.673
But after listening to that book and realizing that I need to worship God no matter what, I stood in church as we're singing songs and I was standing there and I just thought about that question what to do when your Christian influencers fail you.
00:27:43.673 --> 00:27:50.031
The answer is you still praise God because they aren't God and they shouldn't be God.
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